BushcraftOz | The Australian Bushcraft Forum

This forum is currently closed to new user registrations. You are welcome to browse the forum as a guest and existing users may still login with their existing credential's to post on the forum.

canvas hoochy waterproof project

john

Lofty Wiseman
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
127
Reaction score
0
Location
brisbane ( caboolture )
HI GUY'S,
here is an other project im working on , thought i would spend 1/2 hr this arvo, snapping some shots to give you something to think about ,please note that i really don't make anything that's perfect im a bit of a function man .( i spent some years in karate and panelbeating and im just over perfection totally)
 

Attachments

  • griller tray 1.jpg
    griller tray 1.jpg
    43.8 KB · Views: 11
  • fat from griller tray 2.jpg
    fat from griller tray 2.jpg
    39.5 KB · Views: 9
  • heat fat and melt wax in 3.jpg
    heat fat and melt wax in 3.jpg
    48.5 KB · Views: 8
  • apply fat-wax mix 4.jpg
    apply fat-wax mix 4.jpg
    40.9 KB · Views: 6
  • paint fat-wax mix on 5.jpg
    paint fat-wax mix on 5.jpg
    43.7 KB · Views: 7
  • canvas hutchy part waterproofed 6.jpg
    canvas hutchy part waterproofed 6.jpg
    45.7 KB · Views: 7

Hairyman

Ludwig Leichhardt
Archivist
Joined
Sep 13, 2011
Messages
4,084
Reaction score
373
Location
Ironbark, SEQ
Thats good John, so thats dripping/ fat melted with candle wax.
Wonder if a citronella scented candle was used if there would be some insect (and dingo) repellent effect too?
 

john

Lofty Wiseman
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
127
Reaction score
0
Location
brisbane ( caboolture )
HI GUY'S ,
it smells a bit fatty and thought that would be an asset for bow-hunting , never thought of the fly's , just had a look and there are no fly's on it though its not summer ,it is a dirty thing to handle .what i forgot to mention was my motive for using non bought resources , im testing indefinite ways to live in the bush , so if you had a sheet or blanket and had gone off the grid how would you waterproof it for a shelter , i am thinking you would collect the fat from your harvested meat and use it to waterproof your shelter and make oil lamps from as well.im probably leaning to the primitive style of thinking more than traditional ,some might say ,i know in archery a traditional long bow is a wood and fiberglass bow and a self bow as primitive , i see self-bows as traditional and bundle-bows as primitive.
 

Blake

Nest In the Hills
Staff member
Administrator
Joined
May 2, 2011
Messages
3,697
Reaction score
304
Location
Central West, NSW
This is great John. Im thinking about making a traditional tarp like this so this is a great post.

One think with the smell that Ive found helps with my research (if its an issue) is to use some kind of citrus oil in the mix. Orange oil is popular. I have a bunch of orange and lemon trees here that I could try and extract the oils from. Might make a post on that. I suppose you could find native variants like the finger lime that might work? We just need to find a method of extracting the oils in the bush I guess.
 

Aussie123

Never Alone In The Bush
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5,510
Reaction score
747
Location
Melbourne, Victoria
HI GUY'S ,
it smells a bit fatty and thought that would be an asset for bow-hunting , never thought of the fly's , just had a look and there are no fly's on it though its not summer ,it is a dirty thing to handle .what i forgot to mention was my motive for using non bought resources , im testing indefinite ways to live in the bush , so if you had a sheet or blanket and had gone off the grid how would you waterproof it for a shelter , i am thinking you would collect the fat from your harvested meat and use it to waterproof your shelter and make oil lamps from as well.im probably leaning to the primitive style of thinking more than traditional ,some might say ,i know in archery a traditional long bow is a wood and fiberglass bow and a self bow as primitive , i see self-bows as traditional and bundle-bows as primitive.

If you can source it, you could use wax too.
I believe the wax can be heated and rubbed onto the material, then the fabric gently heated and the wax rubbed into the material. (I've never tried)

Many “modern” recipes use linseed oil or even olive oil (veg oil) mixed in with the wax too, but that’s not exactly “primitive”

I’m sure the Traditionalists will know the recipe for wax ?
 

Aussie123

Never Alone In The Bush
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5,510
Reaction score
747
Location
Melbourne, Victoria
This is great John. Im thinking about making a traditional tarp like this so this is a great post.

One think with the smell that Ive found helps with my research (if its an issue) is to use some kind of citrus oil in the mix. Orange oil is popular. I have a bunch of orange and lemon trees here that I could try and extract the oils from. Might make a post on that. I suppose you could find native variants like the finger lime that might work? We just need to find a method of extracting the oils in the bush I guess.

Adding a masking agent, like citrus. will probably not deter critters, only make it nicer for use humans with our poor sense of smell ?
 

Bushman Ben

Les Stroud
Joined
Jul 2, 2012
Messages
60
Reaction score
0
Location
Melbourne
Just talking about this with the other half at lunch; she suggested a few things that might be interesting (she used to be a Quality analysis and does Australian essential oil trading now).

She suggested Palm wax for our northern neighbours, it would help with the sealing and disguise the smell, would also work well in a candle. Also suggested Eucalyptus via a primitive distillation metheod or even just a 'cold press' like a mortar and pestle (or any two rocks) the Eucalyptus should be pretty easy on the nose compared to animal fat. She did note that all commercial Eucalyptus is Steam distilled; but you should be able to rig up a relatively basic solar still that would get a (far) lower grade product.

My two cents for the hutchie is you could get a bit of teatree oil in there; again, the only real way to do this is with a primitive still, but being an insecticide / repellent would be a bonus and it shouldnt be too fragrant to scare off any critters.
 

Templar

F. C. Selous DSO
Joined
May 5, 2011
Messages
2,923
Reaction score
12
Location
Vietnam/Brisbane
Good to see John,

As for types of oils, Boiled Linseed/Flaxseed oil is the most common, generally mixed with wax to proof the cloth, another traditional method of waterproofing was the use of pine tar, similar to that used on the sails of the old ships... the old sails by the way, were the source of material for the so'wester rain coats worn by the sailors of the time too.

Mix the Linseed with wax at about 4:6 and heat then paint on the cloth to be treated.... both sides for a tarp. Then let it dry for a week or two in the shade, then place in the sun for a further week to "cure". This method will require you to iron or heat the cloth with a hair drier to get really into the fabric, the down side is in cold weather the items become quite stiff.

An alternative mix is simply Boiled linseed oil mixed with Iron Oxide and painted on, this is a very traditional mix used by the military of the 17-1800's to waterproof tarps and haversacks/knapsacks... it is simply "Barn Paint" you can still buy it at most hardware stores. The problem is it takes for ever to dry and if you put it on too thick it will crack...
 
Last edited:

auscraft

Henry Arthur Readford
Joined
May 23, 2011
Messages
4,594
Reaction score
335
Location
jjj
John the only water seal I use these days is straight Boiled linseed oil 2-3 light coats allowing to dry in between coats. this should not be smelly or sticky when done properly. The other I used is 50;50 boiledlinseed and straight linseed , this takes longer to dry and is sticky you solve that by rubbing talc power into it.
I dye my cloth before But as Templar said you can get an oil base mix but this make cat stiff you need to break in and re seal with Boiled linseed.
 

john

Lofty Wiseman
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
127
Reaction score
0
Location
brisbane ( caboolture )
thanks for the input guy's ,
i was just thinking before i read bushman ben's post ,that i was reading about tea trees and there oil and the medical uses and was planing to study how to extract the oil and if i could i could boil my canvas in a strong mix of tea tree oil.
 

Walker

John McDouall Stuart
Joined
Jun 13, 2011
Messages
578
Reaction score
6
Location
NSW
John the only water seal I use these days is straight Boiled linseed oil 2-3 light coats allowing to dry in between coats. this should not be smelly or sticky when done properly. The other I used is 50;50 boiledlinseed and straight linseed , this takes longer to dry and is sticky you solve that by rubbing talc power into it.
I dye my cloth before But as Templar said you can get an oil base mix but this make cat stiff you need to break in and re seal with Boiled linseed.

Coincidentally I was using linseed oil the other day (sealing tool handles with 25/75 oil and turps), and noted a warning on the bottle that cloth soaked in linseed oil can spontaneously combust. Would storage of a tarp treated with L-oil be a hazard?

Here's some recipes from my old RM Williams book, circa 1950, (predominantly for waterproofing leather footware but could be adapted for this):

1. Heat one pint of tallow. Hold a six-inch square of auto inner tube with pliers and apply a match to the lower end so the rubber melts and drips off into the tallow - stir well and apply warm.
2. equal parts of paraffin and neatsfoot oil
3. equal parts of beeswax and neatsfoot oil
4. equal parts of beef or mutton fat tallow and neatsfoot oil
5. two parts pine tar and three parts cod liver oil - boil together to blend
6. two parts vaseline and one part paraffin

Some of these would have a 'unique bouquet'!

I reckon recipes (2), (3) or (6), mixed with a few drops of eucalyptus oil or tea tree oil would perhaps be the best choices.
 

Templar

F. C. Selous DSO
Joined
May 5, 2011
Messages
2,923
Reaction score
12
Location
Vietnam/Brisbane
If you use linseed oil you need to let it "dry" in the shade for a week or so spread out to air, to stop this problem from happening, then let it "cure" in the sun for a further week before storage... once this has been done there are no problems.... if the spontanious combustion was an issue the the ols drizabone coats would be bursting into flames all over the shop... as the basis of their treatment is boiled linseed oil mixed with waxes...
 

peter

Ray Mears
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
459
Reaction score
0
If you are, happy to buy wax. Rub it on your tarp, then melt it, with a heat gun / wives hair dryer.
 

Moondog55

Walkabout
Joined
Jun 9, 2011
Messages
0
Reaction score
2
Location
Geelong Victoria Australia
Just an additional note for the real "traditional" users.
if you want to be particular I guess you will want to eschew the use of of petroleum distillates so you need to use real gum turpentine when diluting the mix.
I seem to remember that oilskin was a Viking invention from around 1200-1400 as the linseed oil really does need the use of a drying agent (Terebine) both to be useful in the long term and relatively quick to manufacture.and I think the original formula was based on lead salts. Beeswax however seems to have been in use from the very first days of woven cellulose cloths.
In regards to olive oil, I think we can regard that as a traditional oil, we have been processing that for over 6000 years. I know that linseed oil is old in its technology but not sure when it was first pressed, probably the middle ages. Cotton seed oil although similar wasn't used much until after the development of the industrial "Cotton Gin" by Eli Whitney (and others) in the late 1790s. So cotton seed oil can be traditional or not depending on which era you wish to replicate.
The wikipedia article on linseed oil is interesting if a little shallow as it contains very little historical information
 

john

Lofty Wiseman
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
127
Reaction score
0
Location
brisbane ( caboolture )
thanks peter ,
if you look at my profile pic you will see i don't need a hair dryer LOL,but the wife does have one, i made a dilly bag and the mix of fat and wax was high on wax it came out real good ( the bag holds water ) the haver sack i treated was more fat then wax and its a bit grotty but good,it wont be my last hootch y , but at the moment im going to try to finish the waterproofing today and ill post a pic and give a report on the findings
 

john

Lofty Wiseman
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
127
Reaction score
0
Location
brisbane ( caboolture )
waterproofing test results in

well you guys are right , ill have to go with factory made gear and pick up some linseed oil, i gave it a good hit with the hose and i think its better than standing in the rain but the tarp is as good as a natural shelter i would think ( yet to test one of those )sure makes me think that primitive living peoples were seriously tough, how many of us could stand the cold and rain long term ,i guess our military are the only ones who would have an understanding what the animals and early humans had to live with .
 

Attachments

  • waterproofing test results.jpg
    waterproofing test results.jpg
    49.1 KB · Views: 2
Top